Susan Fenema is a passionate advocate for small business owners who are overwhelmed and need help streamlining and simplifying their operations. With years of experience in project management, Susan understands the challenges these entrepreneurs face in balancing their visionary responsibilities with day-to-day tasks. She has worked with numerous individuals who started their businesses due to their expertise but now find themselves unable to focus on what they love. Susan helps them prioritize their passions, develop time management strategies, and build efficient processes that minimize chaos and allow them to reclaim control. Through her guidance, Susan empowers small business owners to refocus on their trade and enjoy the fulfilling aspects of being a CEO.

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Resources Mentioned

Books Mentioned

3+ Expert Authority Insights™ To Apply Now

  • Emphasizing the importance of processes: Learn how establishing and improving processes within your business can prevent mistakes, create clarity, and promote efficiency.
  • Delegation is key: Discover the benefits of delegating effectively, sharing your vision, and providing clarity to your team to meet your expectations and achieve success.
  • Striking a balance: Understand the significance of balancing efficient back-end operations with sales and marketing efforts to ensure overall business success.
  • If you are dropping leads, your sales never close, and you don’t know how to get from a first call to a paid invoice, maybe your sales process needs some work.


  • Visit www.EAPublishingMethodBook.com today to learn the seven steps to publish and promote your nonfiction, lead, and profit-generating business book in eight weeks.

Wheel of Whatever™

[00:20:51] | Who is a company you would love to work with that you know you can help?

What You’ll Learn In This Episode

Click the time stamp to jump directly to that point in the episode.

[02:34] The importance of having a standard operating procedure.

[03:38] How to attract the right people.

  • Once the right person is in place, it is easier to communicate and attract them. It makes it easier to attract the right people.
  • 100% it starts with you.
  • Be clear about expectations and be transparent. Be open and transparent. Establish a structure and expect the team to be part of the growing structure.
  • Communicate your vision and where you want to go.

[07:27] How often should a company implement process changes, and how constant should it be reviewed?

  • The first thing a company needs to figure out is what to do to fix the first thing they run into when implementing processes.
  • The importance of constantly reviewing the process.
  • Every six months is important, but every month is important to make sure they are alive and breathing and growing with the company. 

[10:30] Identifying the pain points and how to deal with them.

  • Focus on the pain that is rearing its ugliest head right now, such as dropping leads and sales never closing, or how to get from a first call to a paid invoice.
  • Focus on how to close out a client by getting testimonials and case studies.
  • The pros and cons of spreadsheets and CRM tools

[17:00] Susan Fennema’s biggest success story. 

[20:52] Wheel of Whatever

  • Who was a company you would love to work with that you know you can help?

[25:26] Sponsor

[27:08] Imperfect Action Round

  • Make sure you are not dropping leads and have a clear sales process.
  • The biggest or fastest solution for small business owners is to delegate tasks. 
  • The only way you can delegate is if you have a clear process of what you’re expecting.
  • Make sure that what you are doing is in their best interest, even if sometimes it’s not yours.

[29:12] Susan’s Book Recommendation

[30:02] Sponsor – EA Publishing Method

[30:39] www.EAinterviews.com

Episode Transcript

Susan Fennema [00:00]
Hi, this is Susan Fennema of BeyondtheChaos.biz and you’re listening to EA interviews,

Intro [00:06]
EA interviews, Episode 307, inspiration, transformation, success stories and the imperfect action route seven days a week. Join Mario Fachini For today’s Expert Authority Effect interview.

Mario Fachini [00:19]
Business is fun business is a lot of fun. But business can be a giant pain also. If you have a business, you know what I’m talking about? Yeah, let’s grow. Let’s go bring in those new sales leads Gen. And new profits. It’s all gre at and everything until you realize the team that you have, if you have a team might not be supporting you the right way. That’s why I’m excited to have Susan Fennema on the show today, Chief organization for your company, helping you structure everything, create processes create structure to all this, I’m going to bring her up. Right after we thank our sponsor.

Sponsor – EA Publishing Method Book [00:19]
Every business needs a book, including yours. And that’s why I’m launching my new book to help you regardless of where you think your current writing abilities are visit EAPublishingMethodBook.com today to learn the seven steps to publish and promote your non-fiction lead and profit generating business book in eight weeks. Once again, that’s EAPublishingMethodBook.com. Here she is, ladies and gentlemen, Susan Fennema. Susan, how are you feeling today?

Susan Fennema [01:27]
Hi, I’m great today, Mario, thanks so much for having me.

Mario Fachini [01:30]
Oh, it’s my pleasure. I think what you’re doing is fantastic. There’s so many businesses out there that just have chaos going everywhere. And as the chaos eradicating officer, what do you do to help them grow their profits and have a more enjoyable business.

Susan Fennema [01:47]
So the enjoyable parts a big key to how we help. We help small business owners who are overwhelmed, figure out how to streamline and simplify their operations, and then also better manage their projects. So that they are able to focus on that visionary stuff that CEOs should be focusing on, and doing the things that they love. Many of the people we work with, started their business because they were great at their trade. And they don’t even get to do that anymore. And so we help them figure out how to get to what they want to do, how to make time for that, how to build processes, so everything else is running around them much more or much less, I should say chaotically?

Mario Fachini [02:34]
Why would you say it’s so important to have a standard operating procedure in your business?

Susan Fennema [02:40]
There are so many reasons to be able to delegate properly, that’s one, to be able to share your vision of how you want your company to be perceived outside of you know, your head, so to speak, you can’t always get what you want, unless you’re setting that expectation for your team of how you want them to do it. So being able to be clear. The other is having team members be able to meet your expectations. Because if they are trying to figure it out all the time, how do they know when they’re meeting them. I’ve worked with a lot of business owners that are just frustrated that they can’t get anybody to help them. And it turns out that there’s no process around what they’re doing. So it’s going to continue to be failure after failure of all the people that let you down. And I would suggest that if that’s the case, start looking in the mirror a little bit might be you.

Mario Fachini [03:38]
I love that you’re saying that. So I want to ask you a little bit deeper here, because you’re saying they’re having a hard time finding the right people because there’s no processes in place. But it if they don’t have the right person, that person would never see the processes internally with the company because it’s private. So the two part question would be, obviously, once you have the right person, you need the process in place. So that way they have that leadership, the trajectory and they know what the heck to do. However, do you feel that there’s a subconscious deeper reason that once you know the process, and you know what the heck you’re talking about, it’s easier to communicate and you actually will attract them?

Susan Fennema [04:17]
I think that that’s absolutely true. Because those people can see when you’re, when you’re speaking to them in an interview, they can tell if you’re structured or not. They can tell whether or not you’re talking about our team’s process, the way we do things. That kind of thing is so important and it comes out even just in a networking conversation, let alone a job interview.

Mario Fachini [04:44]
Okay. I appreciate that. Because I’ve heard people say that and I’ve experienced it myself when I’m hiring people. It’s like, oh, I need so and so and it’s like 10 years 10 plus 15 plus years ago Oh, oh, did I say that out loud? I should have said like decades ago, were a time of whatever, even 20 years in some cases, when I was looking for the right people, it’s like, was I being the right person? No, I just was like, 10 years ahead, and I’m like, here’s where I want to go. So the fact that you were like, take a look in the mirror, I believe, 100%, it starts with you. But also, you need to be able to communicate it, because maybe you do have that SOP, you just don’t know how to communicate it. So if someone does, they have the vision, they do know, they’ve done a little bit of work on themselves, they do know they need someone, they’re just having a hard time finding them. What would you suggest in that communication piece to be able to say, hey, here’s some things to say, or here’s some ways to communicate it better. Because maybe that’s not their strength.

Susan Fennema [05:49]
I think it’s important in that in that world to be being really clear about your expectation. You know, the other thing they’re going to pick up is, Are you open? Are you transparent, you know, if you are somebody who’s working on your process, here’s a great way to say it, we’ve developed some processes. And what we’re really looking for is our team’s input into how to make them better. So if you say something like that, right, if you say something like that, not only are you establishing that there is a structure, you’re also establishing that you expect them to be part of the growing structure. Because process doesn’t just exist in time, in one moment, in one moment, it evolves and grows with your business as it grows.

Mario Fachini [06:40]
That is hot. Jules, we need to make sure that’s an a quote in the show notes. And wow, I’m thinking of my own team right now, and they’re fantastic, every one of them because the ones who aren’t I already fired. But that is so important, because you got me thinking I could do a better job at communicating the vision and where I want to go for the show and the book publishing and a lot of different things. Because I really do want everyone on my team going, Hey, here’s some ideas and bringing them to me. Because everyone, you know, has great thoughts and ideas. You suggest? What do you like I’m on jeopardy. What do you suggest? To how often should a company be doing that? Do you believe?

Susan Fennema [07:33]
Constantly, constantly? As you’re, once you establish a process, this is how I believe we’re going to do it, the first thing that you’re going to run into is somebody’s going to not do it that way. So what you need to figure out as you’re as you’re implementing those processes is, what do I do to fix that. And I have the approach of stop blaming the person, start blaming the process, and now you’re on the same team to fix the process. So you are working together to make it more clear to say, hey, Sherry, I saw that you did XYZ, but I expected ABC and I think the processes ABC in my mind, can you tell me how to make that more clear. So we don’t do that again. And now you have not blamed Sherry for a mistake. That’s the first thing. And you’ve improved the process, so that sherry or potentially even want, if Sherry just is always going to do XYZ, we’ve also made the ability to make it more clear for the next person.

Mario Fachini [08:50]
And it sounds like you would suggest updating the process not only fixing it, but rolling it out, not just keeping it between them.

Susan Fennema [08:58]
Right, there should be a we have a process of the process. So if you have an update, or if you have a change, how do you communicate that to the team? Where is it stored? How, you know, how do you update it so that somebody doesn’t have to go read three pages, they know what actually changed. And so having that as well as establishing a way over time to constantly be reviewing them. So, you know, every six months, if you’re not growing that fast, could be every month, if you are all of those things are important to make sure that they are alive and breathing and growing with your company.

Mario Fachini [09:41]
That way you realize it’s the process that’s the issue and you don’t think Sherry’s a troublemaker,

Susan Fennema [09:46]
Right? Or maybe she is but now you know.

Mario Fachini [09:53]
What types of processes should people start with? When they go there’s all these different bottles nooks and crannies things, areas, whatever the word is, there’s all these different things you can do within the company and one of my favorite commercials from let’s just say yester year it was from QuickBooks. And it was like it showed this pet shop, the birds chirp, and all this different things. And it’s like, the phone. annoying when it rings. But even worse, when it doesn’t, I’m like, Oh, my gosh. And it’s just like, there’s all these things you can do within the company. Where would you say someone should start? Because I would venture to say there’s at least a dozen or two that I can think of off the top of my head?

Susan Fennema [10:41]
Well, it, I would say, if you’re just starting, if you don’t have anything, start where the biggest pain is. Whatever that pain that is rearing its ugliest head, if it is that you run projects, and none of your projects are finishing on time, you need to put some work into your project management and fulfillment structure. If you are dropping leads, and your sales never close, and you don’t know how to get from a first call to a paid invoice, maybe your sales process needs some work, onboarding new clients, ah, we sold it. When do we start? What do we do now? You know, that’s another area that you want to focus on. I would say later working on how you’re going to close out a client. So offboarding, how do you get that testimonial? How do you get that that permission to use their website? Or the creative you built for your portfolio? How do you get a case study? Is that part of your process when you end a project? So if you really look at taking a client from they have first contacted us to they are giving us an amazing case study? What is the process? What path are they going through? And you obviously can break it down into those little sections. But I would deal with the thing that hurts the most right now first.

Mario Fachini [12:16]
That’s a great expert authority insight, because for everyone, it’s different. It might like you said it might be the leads, it might be the sales, it might be, Hey, that’s not a problem at all. But the internal processes, there’s no communication. I can’t tell you how many people as a matter of fact, one of my good friends today, while we were talking about CRMs for her business, and I was like which one are you using? Because sometimes people are using one that’s not adequate? Or they’re not using anything at all, or they think the spreadsheet is a CRM, which I’m going to say it’s not in but.

Susan Fennema [12:48]
Don’t get me started on? Don’t get me started on spreadsheets.

Mario Fachini [12:53]
Do tell. I want to get you started on spreadsheets. What do you hate about spreadsheets and or love about them?

Susan Fennema [12:56]
Okay? Spreadsheets are not a tool that can help you be proactive. They are a tool to help you measure something. So if you’re looking at numbers that you need to pull out, and you need to manipulate, and you need to figure out that data, that’s what it’s for. But it can’t tell you. Oh, what’s the due in two weeks? What’s due in one week? What who who haven’t I called in three months? Maybe if you sort it, but it’s not proactively pushing you. So I’m anti spreadsheets unless you’re doing something that they were built to do.

Mario Fachini [13:39]
Okay, I like that. Yeah, we’ve been using Pipedrive. For a while now. And there’s another one we are using before that both of them are really great. It just depends on what your company needs. But I’ve been a huge proponent of CRMs, and Basecamp project collaboration, whether you got three people on your team 30 or 300. Some of the stuff we’re talking about here, I’ve been using well over a decade now. And it’s been a game changer, because at least I’ve never said it that way with the proactiveness. But it’s just like, yeah, it tracks the data. But, you know, if you, you can’t organize it in a way where it’s useful. I mean, unless you’re making a list, it’s better than a kick in the throat or post it notes. I’ll give it that. But I mean, when you’re when you get to the point where you get so many leads coming in and you’re you’re just everyday taking phone calls is somewhere in the company, and it’s like, Who would we talk to this week? And where did it end up?

Susan Fennema [14:39]

Mario Fachini [14:39]
I don’t know.

Susan Fennema [14:40]
And your data is not really relational. You know, it’s harder to find out. Oh, are there three people in the company that I’m talking to?

Mario Fachini [14:50]
Or even if you want to follow up with them with with the email, where are you going to get their email so you go to one and then you have to go back to the email to find that it’s.

Susan Fennema [14:58]
And there’s no way, all these CRMs that you’re talking about the ones that I love, the project management tools Basecamp I love teamwork. Asana is a good one as well, all of them capture the emails and communications with that outside party too. So you’re looking at the source of truth in one place instead of trying to figure it out in a bunch of other places.

Mario Fachini [15:21]
Yeah, and also, I will add this in is the compliance rate, and how quickly getting people to actually use it, you can have all the bells and whistles in the world. If no one’s using it, it doesn’t matter. And I love the Pipedrive mobile app. Because when I started the show, there were times I’d be at the computer here typing stuff in brainstorming, and I’m like, I need a break, I go get food. And literally 10 seconds later, I’m walking down the steps, or I’m in the kitchen or something. And it was like something hits me. And I could just go Sheesh. Instead of like, Oh, I’ll edit when I get back. No, you’re not going to that never never gonna remember if you’re out and about in the field. You don’t hit, you know, oh, I’m going to Wi Fi in from the backseat with my laptop and satellite uplink. And no, no, no, no, you’re not going to. So that’s where I see a huge barrier, because people are all over the place now. And it’s like, you need to be able to capture that same thing with Basecamp. They both have apps that can communicate with the team.

Susan Fennema [16:23]
Right? And you’re not wondering what version? It is, right? If you always have the most recent data, you don’t email it to someone and then wonder, Oh, did they make a change? Do I need to get it from them? Where did it go? Now I have multiple copies of my source of truth. It’s just not a good one. I would not use Excel for it either of those project management or for CRM.

Mario Fachini [16:47]
What about Google Sheets?

Susan Fennema [16:49]
It’s the same thing. It’s just not as a doesn’t have as many enhancements I should say. Now, it’s not good either.

Mario Fachini [16:56]
Well, you clearly know what you’re talking about. And I love what you’re sharing here. Tell me with all the people you’ve helped, who would you say is your biggest success story and biggest transformation.

Susan Fennema [17:06]
So we had, and this ties into what we’re talking about at the beginning about whether or not people actually stay and what happens. So we have a group that built software, they had some good communication, they had some good things, they were doing really well. But the accountability and the communication between their teams was just a huge challenge. Things kept falling through big cracks. So we started working with them to create a little, little bit more clarity on where the, the single view of their customer should be. Where did they go for that source of truth, like I’m talking about, it turned out that the customer support area was really the biggest challenge. And all of us that work with customers? No, that’s not an area you want to have challenges with. So we started hammering down on that we evaluated evaluated a bunch of different software options for them. And what they should consider, you know, what they’re using, how they tie together, the beauty of working with a software development company is that you can get them to tie them together, do all that, that back end API stuff. I was just thinking about that. Yeah, so that was helpful. And then we established a very clear process to set expectations for that support team, when you get a request, how long until you have to respond to it, who’s in charge of making sure everybody’s responding to it, and those types of things. And so they all of a sudden they got it. And they understood Oh, this is what I need to do. We gave them some canned responses for when they needed that stuff. That type of thing. And their lead support person ended up resigning over this whole thing. And it really does. Yeah, and it was the best thing that ever happened to that company. And that is.

Mario Fachini [19:07]
Why did they resign just because they felt that their fault or something and they just are they felt that way.

Susan Fennema [19:14]
They were now being held accountable to handling it and to handling it the way it should be handled. And they weren’t interested in that part.

Mario Fachini [19:27]
Imagine that doing your job at a business.

Susan Fennema [19:29]
Right? And so once they once that came to light, it was amazing how quickly they they were like, oh, no, I’ll just leave. Okay, that’s easier than that owner having to fire you, that’s for sure. And they were able to bring somebody that worked for him up. And man she did fantastic. She took the reins and it turned out over time that all sorts of things turned up about how he was managed Seeing them and how he was limiting them. Things that the owner would have never known if we had not dug into that process to figure out how to solve that problem.

Mario Fachini [20:09]
Oh, that’s fantastic to hear. I love hearing that people about the promotion. And it sounds like the woman that was promoted. Good for her. And she actually cared.

Susan Fennema [20:19]
She did. She did she doing a great job. Still, as far as I know, I haven’t checked on that lately.

Mario Fachini [20:24]
Yeah, I sincerely really wish more people just realize that component of it because there’s so many skilled people out there. Communication, I would say, globally, most people don’t really learn a high level of it. It’s just they may or may not learn it, but it takes exactly $0 to care. If you don’t care. I’m not interested.

Susan Fennema [20:47]
I’m with you there for sure.

Mario Fachini [20:51]
Well, thank you for that. I have one more thing before we think our sponsor and it is the. Love it. Wheel of Whatever. So we’re gonna spin it and you told me a few. How’s a good one? He told me if you want yellow or black?

Susan Fennema [21:07]

Mario Fachini [21:12]
How come you want yellow?

Susan Fennema [21:15]
Do you have to talk about that? Because it’s taken so long to spin. I like the bright bold color of yellow.

Mario Fachini [21:21]
Okay, here we go. It’s, you know, when I’m hitting it here, I gotta make sure it’s like random the… There we go. So I gotta aim right there. It was interesting, because one week everyone did yellow, then everyone did Black. I’m like, and no one knew each other. So interesting. So my question. Oh, yeah. My question for you on the yellow is, who was a company would love to work with that, you know, you can help.

Susan Fennema [21:45]
Oh, gosh, um, it’s probably somebody in our pipeline. Right now, there is a client who is an advertising agency and not going to name names. And they are struggling with a lot of a lot of back, backend chaos. They don’t really have any processes, the owner is working almost 24/7 all weekends, he can’t sell. They can’t, they can’t get he or he can’t spend his time selling, I should say, they can’t get more clients in the loop because they’re having to wait so long. Because they’re not finished with everything else. It’s just a mess. And after my 10 years of working in advertising, what we’re doing now with the processes, my team has a lot of advertising experience. And like this is just a perfect client for us to help and we can make a huge difference for them and their team pretty quickly.

Mario Fachini [22:54]
That’s fantastic to hear. Because it sounds like sales and lead gen is not their problem.

Susan Fennema [22:59]
No, no, they they could do that all day. But it doesn’t matter if you can’t fulfill it. You can’t sell it.

Mario Fachini [23:05]
Yeah, I know a lot of companies that and personally, I prefer the front end of working with people, you know, showing them results and all of that. And but I have a great team in place for the fulfillment. And I realized that years ago, but there’s a lot of companies they think are great at the sales, and maybe even the fulfillment, but it’s the whole, like you said on the back end, you look in there and it you know, I remember years ago, I’d go into these huge businesses. And I’m starting off and I’m like, wow, I get inside there. I’m like, this looks worse than anything I’m doing that. The flip side is there’s companies that are running so efficiently on the back end. But that’s all their head is in, it’s just in the back end stuff. They never do any additional sales or marketing. But the thing’s running like a well oiled machine.

Susan Fennema [23:56]
You do find a lot of people succeeding in spite of themselves. And they don’t always realize how much easier and how much more relaxing of a workplace they could have. If they just put some of that structure in place. Get that stuff out of the way. There’s always going to be emergencies, there will always be some chaos raising its ugly head. But if you are not operating in that state all the time, it’s much easier to handle the those things when they arise.

Mario Fachini [24:30]
Well, I’m so glad you’re helping people do it because it’s very much needed. And excuse me, it’s very much needed. And I know what I’ve seen on the back end of companies and you’d never see it from the front.

Susan Fennema [24:45]
Well, that’s that’s the other you know, as you create these processes, you can grow you can scale. And what you have to remember is that this process, this process that your team works, that it is reflecting to the outside world as part of your brand. So they see that they, your client can tell if you’re organized or not. Even if you somehow miraculously make a deadline, they can tell if you’re frantic. They can, they can tell, you might be good at putting on a face, but you can’t do it all the time.

Mario Fachini [25:22]
Oh, I like that. Well, thank you for what you’ve shared. We’re gonna thank our sponsor and come back to the imperfect extra round.

Sponsor – EA Publishing Method Book [25:31]
You’ve heard me say every business needs a book, including yours, and it’s true. And that’s why I’m launching my new book at EAPublishingMethodBook.com. So, you can learn the seven steps to publish and promote your nonfiction lead and profit generating business book in eight weeks. But you know what, don’t take my word for it. Take it from a few of my authors like Lori

Lorie Tenson [25:52]
and I went from having an idea and a possibility to actually getting my book published

Unknown Speaker [25:59]
or Katherine,

Katherine [26:00]
Thank you for making my mom number one selling author.

Sponsor – EA Publishing Method Book [26:04]
Or, Mary Alice,

Mary Alice [26:05]
What he got done for me in three days regarding my book launch. unmanageable,

Sponsor – EA Publishing Method Book [26:13]
John Cody, I’ve worked with Mario over the phone and online and he’s been very helpful in getting me where I needed to go with noting my books, Rocio, There’s no way in the world, I would have been able to do this with somebody else. Again, I’ve attempted it in the past, it didn’t serve me. It’s a matter of fact, I ended up more frustrated than anything. So this has been a very seamless process Adel,

Adel Wilson [26:34]
If you’re looking for an amazing business coach, I highly recommend Mario Fachini

Sponsor – EA Publishing Method Book [26:39]
or Bill Benner,

Bill Benner [26:39]
I can’t make a higher recommendation for me than to work with Mario Fachini. He has been great for for me and right now, I won’t work with anybody else except for Mario,

Sponsor – EA Publishing Method Book [26:50]
Hey, their words not mine. Visit EAPublishingMethodBook.com to get your copy. And I look forward to hearing your transformation is our next video success story. Once again, that’s EAPublishingMethodBook.com.

Mario Fachini [27:06]
And we’re back with the imperfect action around Susan, are you ready to take imperfect action?

Susan Fennema [27:11]
I think I’m ready.

Mario Fachini [27:12]
Alright, I got three questions. 60 second or less answers. The first one is (1) what is the fastest path to the cash?

Susan Fennema [27:21]
The fastest path is to make sure that you are not dropping your leads, It’s that straightforward. Make sure you have a sales process that includes a following up even with those people who might have passed initially, that you’re keeping them in your your, your your follow up plan, and that you have a follow up plan, stay in touch with those people, you never know when they’re going to change their minds.

Mario Fachini [27:47]
Excellent. Number two (2), what is the biggest problem you see your prospects making and the fastest way for them to fix it?

Susan Fennema [27:56]
They believe they have to do everything, because they’re the small business owner and they can’t trust it, or they can’t share it. So the biggest, fastest solution to that is you have to delegate and the only way you can delegate is if you have a clear process of what you’re expecting.

Mario Fachini [28:15]
Excellent. Number two. No, no, no, no. Number three (3), he’s doing good. He caught that. What is the best way to maximize customer lifetime value?

Susan Fennema [28:28]
Serve them well. That’s that’s the bottom line, make sure that what you are doing is in their best interest, even if sometimes it’s not in yours. So sometimes you have to take that hard path and say, We’re gonna give you this extra, you know, deal for free because we messed up. Sometimes you have to do that. Sometimes you have to take extra care with them. Because that specific customer just needs a little bit more, figuring out that communication and how that can flow. It’s all in the mindset of being a servant to your client, as opposed to, you know, taking their money and rented. It’s all in the attitude.

Mario Fachini [29:10]
Excellent. What books would you recommend expert authority world?

Susan Fennema [29:14]
Well, I like traction a lot. That’s the EOS, an Entrepreneurial Operating System book that is usually for teams that are larger than what I work with. But man, it’s a great jumping off place. You can pick and choose things from that even for a smaller team and run with it. I also love Stephen Covey Seven Habits of Highly Effective People. That’s just a great one old school. I know but I love it.

Mario Fachini [29:43]
Can’t go wrong with that. Both great recommendations. Thank you for those. It’s been an absolute pleasure, Susan, thank you so much for sharing.

Katherine [29:52]
Thanks, I enjoyed it. Thanks for having me.

Mario Fachini [29:54]
All right, expert authority world. We have another great episode here today. I’ll see you tomorrow. Have a great day. Thank god bless.

Sponsor – EA Publishing Method Book [30:02]
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